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Post by Tillian Panthesis on Apr 21, 2012 4:39:47 GMT 1
What is says on the title.
I want to compile an asortment of plot holes, the horrible after thoughts (eg: the aftermath of ME3 in a realist PoV), etc; into this thread. It can be also from any of the games, books, comics, etc; as well, the only condition is that it has to be from Mass Effect and it had to be sounded plausable and no bias agenda (eg: siding the bad stuff to get your message across as an anti-ender and vice versa).
The reason why I want to do this is so any future fan fic writers will have an easier time to do a bit of research and brainstorming if they wanted to write a decontructive fic or pointing out the plot holes in a satirical way. (I'm looking at you Clint.). Also it might help for anyone who wanted to write their fan fics in a more realist way.
Note: This is not a ME bashing thread. Also you can still write a pure deconstructive fic and show a bit of love of the ME series.
Ok, now feel free to throw in the plot holes and other elements into the fire. Let's keep this place warm.
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Post by Clint Johnston on Apr 21, 2012 5:26:56 GMT 1
Well Knight brought up a good one in his "Cmdr Shepard is Easily Distracted" fic: That the Normandy could really have intervened with those shuttles, and probably caused their late take off/destruction.
One I've picked up, and plan to enjoy thoroughly is Thane's death scene. He interrupts the assassination attempt, cool. Does a little hand to hand, still cool. Draw his weapon, knocks the guy down, cool. The guy gets back up. Now, instead of hanging back with his pistol and blasting the bejesus out of Kai leng's already weakened shields (preferably with Shepard & team offering their own fire), he CHARGES the guy with the sword firing and ends up stuck through the gut. And has anyone here tried to fire a pistol while running?
Last but not least, Kai Leng pops over the balcony, heads off to do his thing with shepard finally shooting at his plot armored ass, and thane appears from behind him, weakly firing in Leng's general direction (Still with a hole in his gut). Then he leans up against a wall, slumps down it and tells Shepard to go after the bad guy, he's fine. LOL
That's what I have atm. Oh... and the banshees on the last section before you hit the citadel. AUGH!
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Post by jklinders on Apr 21, 2012 12:11:30 GMT 1
When Thane knocked Kai Leng down and he landed about 10 feet away from everyone I was like "shoot him goddamn it!" But really cutscenes are usually a mess of gameplay/story segregation. Saren had a touch of plot armour too but not nearly as bad.
How about Cerberus. In ME 2 EDI indicated that project Lazarus very badly depleted Cerberus' resources. Suddenly out of nowhere in ME 3 the organization is able to effectively match the Alliance in strength. Including cruisers. Where did they get the resources to field entire fleets of ships? The mooks I get, take colonists, indoctrinate and implant them, but the fleets? Bullshit. Bull !@#$ing shit.
ME 3 would have been better if the whole Cerberus is evil thing was out. This to me was the worst example of plothole ridden writing I could see.
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Post by Warhammer Gorvar on Apr 21, 2012 12:50:57 GMT 1
Maybe they had the fleets beforehand? Maybe some Corsairs joined their side? High earning investors? Steal the ships? Personally I would've chosen clone troopers.
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Post by Tillian Panthesis on Apr 21, 2012 13:11:07 GMT 1
Two words about Cerberus: Space Magic. The only plausable reason why Cerberus plays a major part in ME3 undeservingly, is all due to being Mac Walter's pet. As if this problem only plague in fan fction. Anyway, I have one about that infamous level in Thessia. So basically the asari had an intact prothean beacon that they hid inside of that temple. Let me get this straight, this beacon gave them the location of the Citadel, schematics to improve their technological process and they didn't do jack shit about the warning with the Reapers from this said beacon until the Reapers are kicking their front door? Alright, maybe they couldn't translate all because they don't have the macguffin cypher, like Shepard has. Those prom queens could have shared it to the galaxy instead hogging to themselves, as the Citadel law stated. Oh btw, didn't they wrote the law from themselves? Ooooh, hypocites. Also wouldn't the VI in the beacon would have translate the asari language, just to make it easier for them? Like Vigil from Ilos way back in ME1. If so, why aren't they preparing the Reaper invasion and stuff for themselves? ... what the hell, asari?
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Post by jklinders on Apr 21, 2012 14:01:44 GMT 1
Maybe they had the fleets beforehand? Maybe some Corsairs joined their side? High earning investors? Steal the ships? Personally I would've chosen clone troopers. It takes planetary level resources to build them if you take the codex seriously. It took everything they had just to build the Normandy SR-2. It takes more than money. It takes material, eezo and engineers. The SR-2 costs about as much as 2 cruisers if rear admiral asshole from ME 1 can be taken seriously. Pretty sure that the theft of cruisers before the evens of ME 3 would have drawn some notice and during, well all those fleets were deployed and hidden even from TIM. So no on all counts. Tillian, I thought the point of this thread was to point out inconsistencies and plotholes regardless of their status as writers pets. I would have mentioned Liara throughout the whole series but she is such a Mary Bloody Sue who is inextricable from the plot I can't fricking touch her. The Thessia Beacon still pisses me off. That was about the worst writing in the whole series. Those Blue bitches sat on an enormous Prothian resource while the galaxy burned. I did not feel bad at all that Thessia burned. It was their own damn fault. The whole damn thing. I wanted to sheer Javik on when he was lambasting Liara over it. It was absolutely warranted. The whole frigging thing is their fault and I can't even get the option to call that Asari counsellor and her whole race a useless pack of twits over it? BAH!!
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Post by Tillian Panthesis on Apr 21, 2012 14:20:29 GMT 1
Tillian, I thought the point of this thread was to point out inconsistencies and plotholes regardless of their status as writers pets. I would have mentioned Liara throughout the whole series but she is such a Mary Bloody Sue who is inextricable from the plot I can't fricking touch her. Yeah, true. So I'm going to drop this for now. Remind me to do something calm, everytime I think the name "Mac Walters". As for Cerberus, maybe he had insiders in the Alliance before the events in Me2, where they "loan" their ships to them. And they are probably stocking up the fleet with their funds from front investor over the years. Who knows. Still admitivealy, that's is a plothole in ME3. And I still haven't forgiven the asari for the said beacon, especially plotwise. Might have helped to stop the whole series gone pear shaped. And I agree that Thessia deserves it, karma I suppose for being selfish. And during that confrontation with Javik, I've sided him in my playthough. And speaking of lack of options to call that out on the asari council, why wasn't that included? A Renegade Shepard would do that as a default option, but instead BioWare forces us to deal with the asari councilour throwing a hissy fit, while Shepard appologise like a wimp. God, I'm glad I have the option to write decontructive fics like I'm doing now with my comic.
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Post by Warhammer Gorvar on Apr 21, 2012 14:57:34 GMT 1
I still think the Asari Counciler being a traitor and TIM''s lover and her replacement telling you of the beacon would've been better.
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Post by jklinders on Apr 21, 2012 15:31:20 GMT 1
I'd also like to find a way to incorporate the dark energy angle that is different from Drew's supposed original idea. I don't like his original idea but it really did not need to be altogether dropped.
I also have a better motivation for the catalyst using the cycle.
I only really hinted at it before but my idea is that the Catalyst is an AI victor of an ancient war between organics and AI. AI can outperform organics in most ways except for the sheer creativity that comes from randomly looking for new ideas that I could not really see AI trying to do. So in order to advance itself the Catalyst allows organics to advance to FTL ability to research and learn new stuff, then the reapers "harvest" the new tech and incorporate the new ideas then retreat back to dark space to allow the next cycle.
Ideas? Thoughts?
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Post by Warhammer Gorvar on Apr 21, 2012 15:57:11 GMT 1
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Post by Tillian Panthesis on Apr 21, 2012 15:59:48 GMT 1
I'd also like to find a way to incorporate the dark energy angle that is different from Drew's supposed original idea. I don't like his original idea but it really did not need to be altogether dropped. I also have a better motivation for the catalyst using the cycle. I only really hinted at it before but my idea is that the Catalyst is an AI victor of an ancient war between organics and AI. AI can outperform organics in most ways except for the sheer creativity that comes from randomly looking for new ideas that I could not really see AI trying to do. So in order to advance itself the Catalyst allows organics to advance to FTL ability to research and learn new stuff, then the reapers "harvest" the new tech and incorporate the new ideas then retreat back to dark space to allow the next cycle. Ideas? Thoughts? Imo, I think the idea of the Reapers motivation to 'save' the organics from the in coming shitstorm of either the Milky Way galaxy coliding with another galaxy or something on those lines would be slightly better. For the suppose dark energy, I'm not sure yet but I'm sure we'll think something up better soon. Now the motivation about the Catalyst you popose. I think it's better idea than what BioWare has in mind. For shame we get don't get this in ME3. Not only it gives plausable reason but also it gives Shepard an excuse to spit back at the Starbrat and counter their points on why AI and organics must work together side by side.
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Post by jklinders on Apr 21, 2012 16:41:24 GMT 1
Yeah, I think it would fix most of the existing ending without having to change anything but dialogue. Part of the reason I came up with it, but it was also in my mind for while beforehand. It would have been the Reaper's motive in my fanfic had I finished it.
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Post by Knightfall on Apr 21, 2012 20:24:46 GMT 1
I didn't like Specialist Traynor. They wrote a great personality into her, but she was probably near the top of the series' list of convenient plot devices. She was deus ex machina, through and through. Every time Shepard or the crew hit a wall, she'd discover some hidden Cerberus signal, or whatever, and the story would get back on track. It happened a few times, if I recall.
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Post by Warhammer Gorvar on Apr 21, 2012 20:48:53 GMT 1
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Post by jklinders on Apr 21, 2012 20:58:54 GMT 1
I didn't like Specialist Traynor. They wrote a great personality into her, but she was probably near the top of the series' list of convenient plot devices. She was deus ex machina, through and through. Every time Shepard or the crew hit a wall, she'd discover some hidden Cerberus signal, or whatever, and the story would get back on track. It happened a few times, if I recall. Yeah, let's add her to the list along with EDI, Vigil (right conveniently located he was) and the Crucible in general (how were the plans for the super advanced reaper killer device and it's attendant data on Reapers overlooked again? For over 30 years? right next to Earth?). But yeah, if Traynor was on the team that first discovered the archives then it looks a lot like ME 1 and 2 would not have happened. She would have been the galaxy's saviour.
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