|
Post by Tillian Panthesis on Sept 12, 2009 16:06:37 GMT 1
Remember that author from the "Women aren't vending machines" thread. Here's another onr from her where she's directing her critisms stright to Mass Effect. www.gamecritics.com/alex-raymond/beyond-gender-choice-mass-effects-varied-inclusivenessI would read the whole article to write off my PoV but I'm tired as shit and fucking depressed atm. I'd drink a few bottles of beer to drown out my god-damn sorrows if it weren't for the fact I'm really bad at drinking alcohal and stuff. Anyways like the other thread before, read it and discuss or vent freely about this in your own goggles while I'll get some sleep. Maybe tomorow I'll add some contructive input into this. Good night
|
|
|
Post by Zarsthor on Sept 12, 2009 19:22:32 GMT 1
Reading this article I can tell this woman has a thesaurus and went to university but she hasn't learned to differentiate her arguments and use some of the basic essay writing skills. For the most part this is all a one-sided rant with no back up. It also delves into her personal opinions 60% of the time rather than being neutral. The amount of hypocrisy is quite laughable as well. Take this exert for instance.
"In addition, the Asari are sexualized to a much farther extent than any other species" "The Asari are the only alien species in the game with visible females, so they were made to be "hyper-female", encompassing the stereotypical roles for human women."
and a paragraph later:
"In general, the portrayal of women in Mass Effect is better than many games. It meets the required minimum of having female characters that aren't hypersexualized:"
She spent a page ranting on about how over sexualized asari were then said that. OK, right. That's the kind of stuff that's negating on any of her relevant arguments.
"There remains, however, a notable discrepancy between men and women in the galaxy of the game: all the women are hot, but not all of the men are."
I have had some long discussions with Daniel about the number of fugly looking women in Mass Effect. Her definition of hot is obviously just, slim and fits in clothes, because that's the only thing they all had in common.
"This is Othering via world-building: male is the default for most races, but the ones that have females at all are so female they encompass female archetypes, run brothels, strip in bars, and have sex with anyone and anything."
That quote right there annoyed me. I barely saw any of the females in the game having sex with anything that moved. For the most part they were subdued and either ignoring you, talking silently to the same person in a corridor or giving you quests for money. Nobody offered me sex in order to do a quest for them and even the Consort is a difficult one to get sexual intercourse from. You miss that renegade bitching and BAM, no sex for you! Also, are we saying Wong the reporter is running a brothel? The Female C-sec agents are striping in bars for money on the side? Is the Female councilor and the receptionists just opening the legs and shouting "come on in boys?" If so, I missed one hell of a party!
"Tali is saved from the chopping block because, unlike Turian or Krogan females, she is acceptably attractive: she has an hourglass figure, a sexy accent, and her mask allows fans to imagine that she has a face like their favorite actress."
Yes, yes but have you taken a look at her feet? I was thinking some of those things myself, apart form the voice part because she sounds about 12, but when I saw those feet ... yeah turn off.
"Technically some of those Turian or Krogan or Hanar NPCs in the game could be female, despite having deep voices and no breasts. There is no reason an alien society should have the same ideas about femininity or masculinity as we do (or have such ideas at all!)."
Krogan women are larger and more masculine than the males according to game sourced information. They aren't all stay at home breeding types (and the ones that are only because of the genophage) but fight like the men. I'd have to say that's a pretty good species lacking in masculine and feminine ideals. The volus supposedly just view everybody as property rather than specific roles. Does that count as well?
"As I said above, good science fiction challenges our most basic assumptions. Unfortunately, Mass Effect is not good science fiction. In fact, it seems to embrace our own societal "common wisdom" about women and femininity all too wholeheartedly. I can only hope someone on the development team has read Ursula K. LeGuin's The Left Hand of Darkness or some Octavia Butler before writing Mass Effect 2."
For someone so enthused by feminism she sure as hell missed out all the innovative ideas for feminism represented in the game. What about women in the military forces? Even the turian's have women in there military. There's a point in which Garrus and Ashely have a discussion about feminism on Earth and how women had to fight for the right to hold an assault rifle with there brothers. This is something that human society has had issues with for a long time, go watch GI Jane for gods sakes! And for the record, since when has LeGuin been without any sexism? That's like saying Mars bars are all nougart and caramel.
Ok enough ranting at her I'm gonna join in on some of her actually rational thoughts.
Mass effect as a unique story. Well she's right it isn't. The story line is a direct adaptation of the classic "Mars chronicals". A book that has spawned so many others like Babylon 5. Now I don't really care that they have come from this idea because Mass Effect and Babylon 5 are equally awesome in there own ways but they do steal plot and twist it to there own usage which is what makes it so interesting. A good idea is still a good idea and good ideas are reused everywhere. Take a look at Charles Dickens and William Shakespeare. Their works are parody and used everywhere and we still love that shit. Mass Effect 1 as a story is clever and stupid in places. Its not perfect but at the same time it has an incredible amount of weaved story lines that do not relate to one another but always meet up for drinks and a BBQ. That's great story telling and guess what, the story isn't over. its a trilogy and you're left with enough cliff hanger and completion to make it a fully functioning experience.
Now the women, you cannot expect that every different species is going to have completely opposite views to each other. Especially with species that have spent the last few hundred years living with one another. Ideals and morals will intertwine as they all find common ground and adapt. For the most part the other species seemed very open to female equality and role choice. The asari are a little like wise strippers but hey someone's got to be the galaxy's slut and why not the neither gendered group. They look feminine (from a human point of view) but they aren't females.
The problem with feminine and masculine roles is there always going to be some point of difference. We are not built the same, we think differently and act differently. Even with equality there is always going to be something that separates because of these differences. For the most part I found the ideas present in Mass Effect to be mostly liberating to females. However, I worry more about the men. Why no Gay option? Well, maybe its because the society it is being viewed to isn't ready for that rather than the society depicted not being ready. When it comes to sexuality and equality you have to tread carefully. One false move and you either upset the majority of the population or you do what the spice girls did to third wave feminism. Send it back to the 40's. Bioware did a great job depicting small changes to our society that is helpful to inhibit change without taking it to far. To much is always to much but to little can be added to. Perhaps in ME2 or 3 we can see a little more freedom and equality if our society is ready but until then the games world is always going to be a little sensitized for the human's that play it.
|
|
|
Post by Mister Buch on Sept 12, 2009 23:25:27 GMT 1
Hmm... I actually agree with most of the points our essayist makes about the asari, although I think she's exaggerating their significance. Mass Effect presents a very PC future with humans of all races and both genders living and presented almost equally. The asari though... they are all sex objects, every one of them. And the male aliens are ugly and agressive and strong. So. Not perfect.
And I see Zars raises the debate about whether asari are women or non-gendered! I must resist the urge to weigh in!
Technically they are not female, but - they really are. They have breasts, women's voices, female features, and if they give birth, which I think they do, then they have... all the bits that do that. If they're not women, it's only by the narrowest of technicalities.
(I failed to resist the urge.)
|
|
|
Post by meshakhad on Oct 16, 2009 18:20:31 GMT 1
Traditional gender roles don't really apply to the asari. In relation to each other, they are hermaphrodites - they may give birth, or be the father. In relation to other species, they are female - they always give birth (and presumably in a similar fashion to humans, hence their strong resemblance to human females - it's called convergent evolution).
I do have a justification for why most of the asari in the game fit human standards of beauty - they needed it for their individual roles. Liara - a potential love interest for Shepard. Yes, beauty isn't strictly necessary, but it's what people expect. The asari strippers - they're strippers. The asari commandos - they're commandos, therefore they are in excellent physical condition. The asari politicians and diplomats - a pleasant appearance certainly helps in diplomacy.
Note that Matriarch Benezia wasn't particularly attractive. I think it would be interesting if we got to visit an asari planet, and met unattractive or even ugly asari.
|
|
|
Post by Zarsthor on Oct 16, 2009 19:17:17 GMT 1
The disney evolution of feminism. Originally disney showed women of beauty in roles of the bad guy before the later evolution into ugliness is evil. Society wants to believe that only the truely ugly in appearence are evil to sooth their own inner turnmoil of good and bad aspects. Its simplification at its best ravaging young minds and ultimately pushing society into a new age of ignorance. I wonder sometimes if it merely began as a way of quieting the 2nd and 3rd wave feminism. Make them believe that women who desire and have ambition are evil and ugly and they'll want to be submissive and beautiful. Instead it rather shows us up as a society of fickle and easily manipulated creatures.
From that point of view I can see why Benezia was made to be unattractive. She was corrupted, ambitious to believe she could downfall Saren (a male) to begin with and a powerful leader in her society. The fact she is neither male or female was covered by making sure the gamer associated her with the female gender completely by the over large breasts, a symbol of sexual desire and motherhood.
The average asari would be allolowed attractive female qualities because they were submissive to men most of all. Strippers, commando's that take orders and of course the council leader who must have two men back her up on any descion she makes.
|
|
|
Post by Mister Buch on Oct 17, 2009 15:23:03 GMT 1
Asari are women. Maybe technichally not, but they are. They sound like women, they behave like women ('s traditional gender roles), they have women's bodies. They're women, for all intents and purposes. And they are all sexy and beautiful, except the one evil one. Also they need rescuing more than once. It's very Disney. Benezia reminds me a lot of Maleficent from Sleeping Beauty.
|
|
|
Post by Zarsthor on Oct 18, 2009 5:41:02 GMT 1
I'm agreeing they're being used as women in ME but they are NOT women. as a woman I refuse to accept them as part of my gender. they are some hyper form of A sexual beings with 14 year old boy fetishism added as a garnish. They are as much a real woman as the cyborgs in Dead or alive volleyball. I refuse, its insulting to say they are one of us. They are not. End of.
|
|
|
Post by Mister Buch on Oct 18, 2009 13:36:59 GMT 1
Well I know they're not technichally women, seeing as they have one gender.
|
|
|
Post by Rascarin on Oct 24, 2009 17:59:05 GMT 1
Benezia reminds me a lot of Maleficent from Sleeping Beauty. Maleficent is brilliant. One of the best evil female characters EVAR. Benezia reeks.
|
|