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Post by Hodster on Mar 31, 2012 21:31:36 GMT 1
Yeah I'm not sure about the fleets leaving thing. If they did leave then Bioware really should have been more clear on it.
I like the indoctrination theory because I hate this horrible ending so much! I do agree that during TIM conversation they were definitely trying to Indoctrinate Shepard. I don't think the star child was trying to trick you into indoctrination like the theory says, but again I'm going to pretend it does, when I play it again, because the ending as is sucks.
I don't like the green ending because of what you guys have already said. I don't think it's impossible for the reapers to come back in the control ending. There's always that chance that they will. I only like the destroy ending the best because the reapers are truly killed off. I want to pick that Yellow ending damnit! ;D
But yeah I think what you said, Buch, is what Bioware was going for.
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Post by Mister Buch on Mar 31, 2012 22:36:32 GMT 1
No one is buying my idea about the fleets leaving... For the record, I just don't see why Bioware would intentionally imply that they didn't.
Anyway - roll on April. I'm fascinated to see what if anything will happen next in this extraordinary ending debacle.
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Post by Hodster on Mar 31, 2012 23:16:45 GMT 1
No one is buying my idea about the fleets leaving... For the record, I just don't see why Bioware would intentionally imply that they didn't. Anyway - roll on April. I'm fascinated to see what if anything will happen next in this extraordinary ending debacle. Bad writing on bioware's part? But yeah I'm fascinated to see what happens too. Also I thought about why I, and maybe many other people, believe in the indoctrination theory. With the Indoctrination theory there is hope that there will be dlc for a better ending. Thus people are desperately hoping there is something else afterwards. Of course this means Bioware cut the real ending out to make dlc. So it comes down too, Ending as is = a lot of plot holes no conclusion. Indoctrination theory alone = even less of a conclusion. Indoctrination theory with ending dlc that was cut = They cut the real ending from the main game! Indoctrination theory alone would overall be less then the ending as is. But with ending dlc it has potential to be a really good ending! Just some thoughts I had.
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Post by Mister Buch on Mar 31, 2012 23:24:43 GMT 1
Desperate hope is no reason to believe a theory, though. The only good reason to believe a theory is because it's more supported than the alternative.
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Post by Mister Buch on Mar 31, 2012 23:42:04 GMT 1
Okay - I have to concede this though-- my thing about the fleets leaving. I have very little evidence for that. Just that thing about the space background being empty. This is pretty thin.
Just - why would the writers intentionally strand every fleet on Earth? I find it more likely that they messed up in the editing. We see the Normandy crew gathered together again later, so we must have missed something. There must be a continuity error. I think it's logical to assume that the fleets would leave in this missing time. The people on Palaven and Thessia, for example, have some serious rebuilding / healing / rehousing work ahead of them. They'd want to get home.
*shuts up*
I should have called it my Attemtped Indoctrination Theory - plus bonus fleets theory.
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Post by Hodster on Mar 31, 2012 23:47:08 GMT 1
With the fleets leaving thing. Why leave before the fight is done? I understand they want to get back to their own worlds to defend them. But why leave earth before the reapers are completely wiped out there first?
The only way I can see them leaving before the crucible fires is if the reapers were completely defeated at earth. But we see when the crucible fires that it hits reapers still in space and on the ground. So the alien races just pick up and leave before the fighting was done? I would think they would stay and help even if one reaper was left alive.
Or they saw the crucible/citadel charging up and decide to get the hell out before it blew.
Trust me I don't want all the fleets stranded in the sol system but it really looks like they are.
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Post by Mister Buch on Mar 31, 2012 23:56:50 GMT 1
Oh no, I must disagree with this - the fight IS done. The first blast from the Crucible destroys or drags-away every Reaper at once. The battle is over immediately.
First the Reapers die or leave, and then in the next scene the Crucible destroys the Relays (including the one where the re-crewed Normandy is already in the process of using) by shooting a beam of coloured ligt (into a wide area of space with no fleets in it, but again I accept this last point is fairly flimsy).
I assume there are events they forgot to show us, between the two scenes.
*shuts up... uh, again*
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Post by Hodster on Mar 31, 2012 23:59:31 GMT 1
Desperate hope is no reason to believe a theory, though. The only good reason to believe a theory is because it's more supported than the alternative. I was just thinking about why some people want to believe it because it does give hope for a better ending and it does have some good support behind it. Also desperate hope was the only reason that the species of the galaxy had any reason to believe the theory that the crucible would stop the reapers. The only support they had that it would do anything is because some dead people said that it would do something to save them. Hell even after building it they had no idea what it would do. So all they had was some desperate hope that it would do something. I do agree with "The only good reason to believe a theory is because it's more supported than the alternative." But some people will believe in the theory for hope that there is a better ending. Again I prefer the indoctrination theory over the current ending. But I don't think it's what Bioware intended and thus it's not true.
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Post by Mister Buch on Apr 1, 2012 0:01:58 GMT 1
Yeah... I was being pretty rude, the way I phrased that. I have a 'thing' about theories, and the indoctrination theory annoys me because of that.
Sorry.
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Post by Hodster on Apr 1, 2012 0:07:46 GMT 1
Oh no, I must disagree with this - the fight IS done. The first blast from the Crucible destroys or drags-away every Reaper at once. The battle is over immediately. First the Reapers die or leave, and then in the next scene the Crucible destroys the Relays (including the one where the re-crewed Normandy is already in the process of using) by shooting a beam of coloured ligt (into a wide area of space with no fleets in it, but again I accept this last point is fairly flimsy). I assume there are events they forgot to show us, between the two scenes. *shuts up... uh, again* Oh ok! So you're saying that there is time between when the crucible kills the reapers on earth to it firing at the relays? I thought you meant that our allies left before the crucible even killed the reapers at earth. Ok ok I get what you're trying to say now. Basically crucible kills/reprograms reapers on earth. For the next few, lets say hours, the victorious Allied forces gather up their troops and depart the sole system. Then after they left the crucible acts up again and fires a beam into the relay and wipes the rest of the galaxy clean of reapers. Earth cleansed - Allies gather up whats left and returns to homeworlds - Sometime after they leave Crucible cleanses the rest of the galaxy! Am I understanding now? And in between firing while the aliens gather their guys the Normandy gathered up our squad.
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Post by Mister Buch on Apr 1, 2012 0:12:42 GMT 1
Yeah, that's what I meant!
I know it's the immediate NEXT scene -- but like I say: empty space during the coloured shot, reassembled Normandy crew already in a Relay jump. I think Bioware did not intend the implication that the fleets are stranded, for these reasons and because 'why would they?' They just failed to make their montage sequence clear.
I'm not 100% behind this - for instance why does Shepard / the Crucible wait so long? And why does no-one find him/her on the Citadel during all this? I have no clue. But I'm calling it much more likely.
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Post by Hodster on Apr 1, 2012 0:23:33 GMT 1
Ok! Sweet, yeah that's something I can get behind! Not a lot of evidence to really support this but this would be much better then them getting stranded!
Yeah I was just confused on the whole thing and didn't understand it so I was just trying to understand it ;D
But if bioware had shown time between the firings and Normandy getting it's crew Aliens leaving blah blah blah the whole last part, of the ending, would have made more sense.
Sorry if I got annoying, which I bet I did lol
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Post by Mister Buch on Apr 1, 2012 0:25:42 GMT 1
We are very polite. I was the one being annoying, Hods. but yeah - that's my (second) theory. I have the same doubts about it.
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Post by Hodster on Apr 1, 2012 0:29:08 GMT 1
We are very polite. We are! If this was anywhere else on the internet and between two other people well... it wouldn't be pretty.
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